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Legalize pot? Think long and hard first

July 29, 2013

The issue of legalizing marijuana for medical purposes is coming up again in Minnesota. On Sunday S....

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(20)

newulm67

Jul-30-13 10:34 PM

Dana You must be smoking some "Wacky Tabacky" before your write all of your comments. No other reason. Yu are a joke.

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23aka23

Jul-31-13 1:19 PM

In 2007, the last year for which I can find stats, 11,629 MN citizens were imprisoned for using a drug that is recognized by even the DEA as less harmful than aspirin.

Yes, let's think long and hard.In the May 30, 2013 issue of the New England Journal of Medicine, 76% of doctors responding to a survey said they would approve the prescription of cannabis for their patients On Oct 7, 2003 Patent #6630507 was issued to the US Government through the Department of Health And Human Services for the use of cannabinoids as antioxidants and neuroprotectants. Prof. Yosef Sarne of Tel Aviv University’s Adelson Center for the Biology of Addictive Diseases at the Sackler Faculty of Medicine finds the same effect in that cannabis "protects the brain from long-term cognitive damage in the wake of injury from hypoxia, seizures, or toxic drugs."

Denying ill people the medicine they need is a crime against humanity. Prohibitionists are killing people. They should be jailed like any other se

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23aka23

Jul-31-13 1:37 PM

Stand your ground Dana. The facts are on your side. Comments like those from newulm6 expose prohibitionists for what they are: small people with small minds, lacking any factual basis for their position, wanting only to deny sick people the medicine they so desperately need. People like newulm67 resort to name-calling and derision because that's all they have to offer in this discussion. Your compassion is nothing to sneer at as newulm6 does. In fact, however long it takes, compassion and goodwill will overcome the hatred and mean-spirited ignorance of those who, like newulm67, would, and have, set themselves up as the judges of who will be allowed the medicine they need. He is “the joke.” And a mean one at that.

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23aka23

Jul-31-13 8:00 PM

Unfortunately, the Journal's character count is inaccurate. To finish my comment of Jul-31-13 1:19 PM, “They (prohbitionists) should be jailed, and sodomized on a regular basis, like any other serial killer.”

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23aka23

Jul-31-13 9:01 PM

Nothing to say, newulm67, you craven putz? Back up your position with some facts. Oh, I forgot. You have none. But then, hatred needs no defense. Virtue is its own reward, and hatred for the helpless needs no justification. Lynch the “Others”. After all, they're “Other.”

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mnsotn

Jul-31-13 9:53 PM

Legalize pot and you will have even more kids getting their hands on it. Legalizing it will put it on the shelves of every convenience store in town.

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middleclassworker

Aug-01-13 12:29 AM

We just don't need it. There are more important things to do than put more drugs into society.

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Leander

Aug-01-13 10:24 AM

"We just don't need it. There are more important things to do than put more drugs into society."

Why don't we take the drugs that are currently far more harmful than marijuana off the streets, instead of championing prohibition as the answer. Alcohol, cigarettes, opiates (pain killers). Marijuana is a plant, which is consumed most often unaltered from its natural form. Can you say that about alcohol, or cigarettes, or pain killers? Those are drugs... marijuana is a plant that has grown on this planet along side humans for thousands of years. We don't have to rip it out of the ground and then distill it, or spray it with chemicals that make it addictive, it isn't proven to cause lung cancer, or liver cancer, and finally it has proven to have medical benefits for many groups of people. If marijuana isn't a suitable recreational drug, please explain to me how any of those others are.

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23aka23

Aug-01-13 12:18 PM

Wrong again. Karen O’Keefe, Esq. Director of State Policies for the Marijuana Policy Project and Mitch Earleywine, Ph.D. , Professor of Psychology University at Albany, State University of New York report in their June, 2011 study, “MARIJUANA USE BY YOUNG PEOPLE : The Impact of State Medical Marijuana Laws ” that teen of csannabis use declines in states where medical marijuana is legal. “Of the 13 states with effective medical marijuana laws with before-and-after data on teen marijuana use, only the two with the most recently enacted laws (Michigan and New Mexico) have indicated possible increases, both of which are modest and within confidence intervals. ” As it turns out, the longer states allow the use of medical marijuana, the less teens use cannabis. Anyone may inform themselves of the facts rather than spew ignorant claims intended to mislead people, and deny desperate patients the medicine they need. This report, and many others supporting it,is online.

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JReader

Aug-01-13 6:13 PM

"As it turns out, the longer states allow the use of medical marijuana, the less teens use cannabis."

And just what is the causation in this instance ?

Unless one trait can be tied directly to the other there is really nothing susbtantial that be determined.

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23aka23

Aug-01-13 7:57 PM

Thank you, JReader. Your question is incisive, and, as yet, unanswered by the studies extant. I can speculate, and enjoy doing so. Please don't think I endorse my speculations. I am, like others, awaiting information, and evidence. I speculate that the longer cannabis is seen as “old folks” medicine, or medicine needed to help those who are weak and ill, the less cachet it has for the young. It just ceases to be “cool”, or a demonstration of independence from a generation dying from its own poisons, political and environmental. I “agreed” with your comment. Bless you for your critical thinking.

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23aka23

Aug-01-13 8:02 PM

Prohibitionists owe decent people answers why they rejoice that, stripped of our 4th amendment rights, we are subordinate to a despotic government with a heavily armed, often corrupt, militarized police force whose deadly intrusions into our homes and lives they condone; why they wish to continue spending $90B/yr prosecuting and caging their fellow citizens for a drug less dangerous than aspirin; why they are waging war on their own families, friends andneighbours;(Will they still applaud, when due to their venomous approach, their own children are caged and raped, and thereafter denied the basic rights of citizens?; why they are helping fuel a budget crisis that closes hospitals, schools and libraries; why they rejoice at wasting precious resources on prohibition related undercover work while rapists and murderers walk free; why they would deny even terminally ill patients the relief that cannabis can provide. I'd LOVE some FACT based answers. (with thx and a nod to malcome kyle)

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23aka23

Aug-01-13 8:35 PM

JReader, the only factual determinate is that cannabis use among teens declines after the legalization of medical cannabis.That's the conclusion of these studies, and the FACT these studies have uncovered. Rails in contra are evidence of wilful ignorance, prejudice, and hate of the helpless. Compassion SHOULD be, MUST be, the determining impetus in this discussion. If only others would, like you, think critically on these issues, intelligently questioning, we would arrive at a political decision based on facts, rather than uninformed bias.

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JReader

Aug-02-13 9:30 AM

Ok - for starters, show me the usage rates among teens in states that haven't legalized the medical use of pot. What do those trens tell us ?And, more importantly where is the link that legalization causes the decreased usage in teens ? Are teens using pot legally in these states (for medically prescribed reasons) included in the study ? If so, what catagory to they now fall in to ? Could this account for some of the shifting numbers ?

If you are going to state that "A" results in "B" you need to provide more of the "why" if you want to give your claims any credibility.

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23aka23

Aug-02-13 12:21 PM

JReader, I didn't that say that "that 'A' results in 'B' ." That result was found by the federally financed study I named. "show me the usage rates among teens in states that haven't legalized the medical use of pot." Those stats are easily found by anyone who wishes to find them. Those for Ca., the "oldest" MMJ state,are on the first page of the study named. “Are teens using pot legally in these states?" There are no states in which teens may use cannabis legally other than as medicine prescribed a licensed physician. Unless you mean 18 & 19 yr olds in Washington state, and Colorado. “where is the link that legalization causes the decreased usage in teens ?” In any of the many studies that have looked into the question, like the one I refereed to. See also, “Medical Marijuana Laws and Teen Marijuana Use“, by D. Mark Anderson Montanta State University,Benjamin Hansen, University of Oregon, Daniel I. Rees,University of Colorado, Denver Institute

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23aka23

Aug-02-13 12:25 PM

There again seems to e a problem with "The Journal's" word count. The last sentence of my previous post should have read "See also, 'Medical Marijuana Laws and Teen Marijuana Use', by D. Mark Anderson Montanta State University,Benjamin Hansen, University of Oregon, Daniel I. Rees,University of Colorado, Denver Institute for the Study of Labor. also online."

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JReader

Aug-02-13 2:05 PM

"As it turns out, the longer states allow the use of medical marijuana, the less teens use cannabis."

That statement of yours sure sounds like "A" causes "B" to me.

People can forward most any cause they want by providing only select pieces of information.

Let's cut to the chase shall we ? Why does legalizing marijuana decrease it's usage in teens ?

If there is really something to these studies and it has been carried on for a number of years they really must have reached some fairly strong conclusions as to why this correaltion exits.

One last point, hasn't marijuana usage also decreased for teens in a number of states that don't currently have medical use laws ?

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23aka23

Aug-02-13 2:49 PM

“'As it turns out, the longer states allow the use of medical marijuana, the less teens use cannabis.' That statement of yours sure sounds like "A" causes "B" to me.'” Then you are mistaken. It is the replicated conclusion of scholars and researchers working today, whose peer-reviewed, federally funded studies have reached that conclusion. Having pointed this out to you previously, I won't bother doing so again if you continue to beat that dead horse. My statement is not an opinion. It is a brief summary of the science-based, statistical studies I have repeatedly pointed you to. “People can forward most any cause they want by providing only select pieces of information.“ If simply denying the validity of these oft-repeated studies is your only argument then it is w/o value. Denial is not evidence. Do you have any facts that refute these studies?

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23aka23

Aug-02-13 2:51 PM

“Let's cut to the chase shall we ? Why does legalizing marijuana decrease it's usage in teens?“ Why did children in the 20's hold goldfish swallowing contests? What generated the craze for flag-pole sitting? Why did children cram themselves into telephone booths in the 30s till they nearly asphyxiated themselves? Why do half the people in the Guinness Book of World Records do what they do? These studies don't attempt to answer why. They measure teen use of cannabis before and after legalization of MMJ. If this is an area of real concern to you, I refer you to “Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds” written in 1841 by Charles McKay. For a more modern approach to the question, please see the lectures on the philosophy of mind by Oxford University, especially those concerning the neuro-biological basis of desire, emotion, and long term learning.

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23aka23

Aug-02-13 2:52 PM

“Facts are stubborn things,” as John Adams said. I'm thrilled that you, JReader, seem to have the intellectual courage to simply deny facts any effect on your opinion. I have offered you facts. You have offered a rebuttal based on nothing more than blind denial of them, re-enforcing opinions w/o basis. “If there is really something to these studies and it has been carried on for a number of years they really must have reached some fairly strong conclusions as to why this correaltion exits.” You're again mistaken. That is not the purpose of these studies. That would be mere speculation; hardly the provenance of science. “One last point, hasn't marijuana usage also decreased for teens in a number of states that don't currently have medical use laws?” Then why would you be concerned at all about our youth in legalizing MMJ for patients in need? In fact, your premise is mistaken.

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